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	<title>Comments on: Getting informal at the BBC</title>
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		<title>By: Al</title>
		<link>http://disappearing.wordpress.com/2009/07/14/getting-informal-at-the-bbc/#comment-59</link>
		<dc:creator>Al</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Jul 2009 08:38:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://disappearing.wordpress.com/?p=179#comment-59</guid>
		<description>Hi both -

First of all, apologies for a slow reply - life is too hectic just now!

Hmm, Frances, fascinated by your comment about the perceived formality of the BBC online. Looked at in broad terms, it&#039;s a great reminder that a particular web presence should always cross-breed the needs of internet comms with the pre-existing norms of the organisation / person presenting themselves.

Also, I wish I had your depth of web experience! I didn&#039;t even send my first email till about 1994, tho&#039; I did manage to get in a fair amount of BBC Basic programming back in the 80s. Nothing online, alas...

And thanks for your comments and retweets, Dan - enjoying the way you&#039;re showing the workings, and in fact about to wander over to the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/digitalrevolution/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Digital Revolution blog&lt;/a&gt;  to catch up with the latest developments...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi both -</p>
<p>First of all, apologies for a slow reply &#8211; life is too hectic just now!</p>
<p>Hmm, Frances, fascinated by your comment about the perceived formality of the BBC online. Looked at in broad terms, it&#8217;s a great reminder that a particular web presence should always cross-breed the needs of internet comms with the pre-existing norms of the organisation / person presenting themselves.</p>
<p>Also, I wish I had your depth of web experience! I didn&#8217;t even send my first email till about 1994, tho&#8217; I did manage to get in a fair amount of BBC Basic programming back in the 80s. Nothing online, alas&#8230;</p>
<p>And thanks for your comments and retweets, Dan &#8211; enjoying the way you&#8217;re showing the workings, and in fact about to wander over to the <a href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/digitalrevolution/" rel="nofollow">Digital Revolution blog</a>  to catch up with the latest developments&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Dan Biddle</title>
		<link>http://disappearing.wordpress.com/2009/07/14/getting-informal-at-the-bbc/#comment-58</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan Biddle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Jul 2009 15:50:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://disappearing.wordpress.com/?p=179#comment-58</guid>
		<description>Hi Al (and Frances in the comments),

I think between you you&#039;ve hit the nail on its head. The differences of the two media (TV and web) carry with them differences in expectation.

The launch event &#039;The Web At 20&#039; which Al attended was the launch of a TV programme: a four part series for BBC Two, which takes its remit to inform, educate and entertain very seriously. As such it heralded much of the traditional TV content and the event was populated with classic tropes described very well by Al &#039;We – as audience – audienced before them.&#039; particularly pleasing (rather Tibor Fischer-esque, I thought).

And the product of the next six months of hard work by the production will need to be of the highest quality and present a balanced, intelligent (and intelligible!) document of the web as it exists today: its history, of course; its present forms and (mis)uses; its possible futures... And we will be focusing on how this phenomenal invention continues to change humanity. Roll credits at speeds beyond the capabilities of the human eye...

And that&#039;s how we do it.

Only, this time, we&#039;re also doing it completely differently. This is an open production: we&#039;re already publishing our current (note, current, not final) thinking re scripts, topics, web theories on our blog, with the hope that engaged users will engage; share stories; guide our inquiry; prick our arrogance; enlighten our ignorance; help us tell a better story about the web - which is as much your story as it is anyone&#039;s who has been online in the last 20 years.

I won&#039;t clutter Al&#039;s blog by rewriting our whole mission statement, &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/digitalrevolution/2009/07/what-is-digital-revolution-wor.shtml&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;you can find out more on our blog&lt;/a&gt;, where you an also &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/digitalrevolution/2009/07/the-web-is-too-good-for-us.shtml#P82851488&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;read Al&#039;s excellent critique&lt;/a&gt; of our first real programme manifesto regards the web&#039;s libertarian ideals and the (natural? / inevitable?) corruption of those by humanity. It&#039;s a brilliant piece of reply, has been much appreciated by members of the production, and is exactly the kind of thing we&#039;re after.

So, to pull some semblance of sense from what I can only imagine now reads as waffle, we ARE planning to make a high profile, high quality product - as the BBC should. BUT we&#039;re doing it openly, we&#039;re &lt;a&gt;showing the workings&lt;/a&gt;, sharing our (hopefully not too many or mammoth) mistakes as well as our smarts, in the hope that the web will join us to tell its tale well.

Many thanks,
Dan</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Al (and Frances in the comments),</p>
<p>I think between you you&#8217;ve hit the nail on its head. The differences of the two media (TV and web) carry with them differences in expectation.</p>
<p>The launch event &#8216;The Web At 20&#8242; which Al attended was the launch of a TV programme: a four part series for BBC Two, which takes its remit to inform, educate and entertain very seriously. As such it heralded much of the traditional TV content and the event was populated with classic tropes described very well by Al &#8216;We – as audience – audienced before them.&#8217; particularly pleasing (rather Tibor Fischer-esque, I thought).</p>
<p>And the product of the next six months of hard work by the production will need to be of the highest quality and present a balanced, intelligent (and intelligible!) document of the web as it exists today: its history, of course; its present forms and (mis)uses; its possible futures&#8230; And we will be focusing on how this phenomenal invention continues to change humanity. Roll credits at speeds beyond the capabilities of the human eye&#8230;</p>
<p>And that&#8217;s how we do it.</p>
<p>Only, this time, we&#8217;re also doing it completely differently. This is an open production: we&#8217;re already publishing our current (note, current, not final) thinking re scripts, topics, web theories on our blog, with the hope that engaged users will engage; share stories; guide our inquiry; prick our arrogance; enlighten our ignorance; help us tell a better story about the web &#8211; which is as much your story as it is anyone&#8217;s who has been online in the last 20 years.</p>
<p>I won&#8217;t clutter Al&#8217;s blog by rewriting our whole mission statement, <a href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/digitalrevolution/2009/07/what-is-digital-revolution-wor.shtml" rel="nofollow">you can find out more on our blog</a>, where you an also <a href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/digitalrevolution/2009/07/the-web-is-too-good-for-us.shtml#P82851488" rel="nofollow">read Al&#8217;s excellent critique</a> of our first real programme manifesto regards the web&#8217;s libertarian ideals and the (natural? / inevitable?) corruption of those by humanity. It&#8217;s a brilliant piece of reply, has been much appreciated by members of the production, and is exactly the kind of thing we&#8217;re after.</p>
<p>So, to pull some semblance of sense from what I can only imagine now reads as waffle, we ARE planning to make a high profile, high quality product &#8211; as the BBC should. BUT we&#8217;re doing it openly, we&#8217;re <a>showing the workings</a>, sharing our (hopefully not too many or mammoth) mistakes as well as our smarts, in the hope that the web will join us to tell its tale well.</p>
<p>Many thanks,<br />
Dan</p>
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		<title>By: Frances Durling</title>
		<link>http://disappearing.wordpress.com/2009/07/14/getting-informal-at-the-bbc/#comment-57</link>
		<dc:creator>Frances Durling</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Jul 2009 16:09:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://disappearing.wordpress.com/?p=179#comment-57</guid>
		<description>Sadly I have not been able to view the link to Tim BL &amp; others here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/digitalrevolution/2009/07/more-from-web-at-20.shtml

as the screen has constantly displayed the message &#039;This content doesn&#039;t seem to be working. Try again later&#039;.

The (perceived) formality of the BBC in presenting itself online in comparison to others there is, imho, not a bad thing.

As a media consumer of 5+ decades it seems quite natural for each sector to have an ever evolving hierarchy. This is what I view as happening online.

On a low level point from the days when BBC radio announcers wore dinner jackets to BBC television presenters in jeans is (slow) progression!

For me using the internet started with JANET and BBS. This juxtaposition of Intellect and text chat I see as replicated in the expansion of the Web.

My Son arrived at the same time as the Web. From toddlerhood he had his own computer and then later access to the internet and the Web. Now it is his career. These young but lifelong users are the real shapers of it&#039;s future. They are the Web professionals and I hope to enjoy the journey for a lot longer wherever they take us!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sadly I have not been able to view the link to Tim BL &amp; others here:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/digitalrevolution/2009/07/more-from-web-at-20.shtml" rel="nofollow">http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/digitalrevolution/2009/07/more-from-web-at-20.shtml</a></p>
<p>as the screen has constantly displayed the message &#8216;This content doesn&#8217;t seem to be working. Try again later&#8217;.</p>
<p>The (perceived) formality of the BBC in presenting itself online in comparison to others there is, imho, not a bad thing.</p>
<p>As a media consumer of 5+ decades it seems quite natural for each sector to have an ever evolving hierarchy. This is what I view as happening online.</p>
<p>On a low level point from the days when BBC radio announcers wore dinner jackets to BBC television presenters in jeans is (slow) progression!</p>
<p>For me using the internet started with JANET and BBS. This juxtaposition of Intellect and text chat I see as replicated in the expansion of the Web.</p>
<p>My Son arrived at the same time as the Web. From toddlerhood he had his own computer and then later access to the internet and the Web. Now it is his career. These young but lifelong users are the real shapers of it&#8217;s future. They are the Web professionals and I hope to enjoy the journey for a lot longer wherever they take us!</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Al</title>
		<link>http://disappearing.wordpress.com/2009/07/14/getting-informal-at-the-bbc/#comment-56</link>
		<dc:creator>Al</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Jul 2009 14:23:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://disappearing.wordpress.com/?p=179#comment-56</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s a really interesting point - going to be very interesting to see how moves between formal and informal content are flagged up within the programmes.

Also brings to mind all the recent mobile phone footage from Iran, from stuff on the streets to John Simpson in his hotel room. Immediate, powerful content is becoming more important than well-crafted form - which makes me wonder also how the programmes will embody the web&#039;s powers of immediacy. How will that impact on shooting and particularly editing schedules? How malleable will the final cut be, and where and when will the final cut line be drawn?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s a really interesting point &#8211; going to be very interesting to see how moves between formal and informal content are flagged up within the programmes.</p>
<p>Also brings to mind all the recent mobile phone footage from Iran, from stuff on the streets to John Simpson in his hotel room. Immediate, powerful content is becoming more important than well-crafted form &#8211; which makes me wonder also how the programmes will embody the web&#8217;s powers of immediacy. How will that impact on shooting and particularly editing schedules? How malleable will the final cut be, and where and when will the final cut line be drawn?</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Morriss</title>
		<link>http://disappearing.wordpress.com/2009/07/14/getting-informal-at-the-bbc/#comment-55</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Morriss</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Jul 2009 12:46:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://disappearing.wordpress.com/?p=179#comment-55</guid>
		<description>This makes me think of when &quot;they&quot; (probably the BBC - can&#039;t remember) show amateur footage they sometimes have a caption &quot;camcorder footage&quot;, or when they say on the news, &quot;here&#039;s some footage shot on a mobile phone&quot; - i.e. it&#039;s not our fault the quality is so bad.

I wonder if anything informal on these programmes will be suitably introduced with cues like these.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This makes me think of when &#8220;they&#8221; (probably the BBC &#8211; can&#8217;t remember) show amateur footage they sometimes have a caption &#8220;camcorder footage&#8221;, or when they say on the news, &#8220;here&#8217;s some footage shot on a mobile phone&#8221; &#8211; i.e. it&#8217;s not our fault the quality is so bad.</p>
<p>I wonder if anything informal on these programmes will be suitably introduced with cues like these.</p>
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